joncf said:
The M113 is a more modern engine??? It is newer, but it lacks variable valve timing, and 4 valve technology that the M119 has.... and which EVERY automaker has since implemented. I would call THAT modern.. not 3 valve, twin spark technology that was invented by Asian automakers in the 80’s. The only benefit would be fewer moving parts and possibly reduced emissions. It certainly didn’t help fuel economy because they are hilariously inefficient.. no better than the M119. Basically every combustion engine being produced today, has 4 valves per cylinder and VVT.. The M113 lacked it.. and they MB never made that mistake again. The twin spark is meaningless in reliability, longevity or performance aspects and was just an attempt to “clean up” emissions. The M119 doesn’t really have any significant known issues if well maintained while the M112 and M113 commonly have oil consumption and valve guide seal issues. I’d say they are equally reliable, but the M119 wins the durability and longevity contest. There are tons of W140’s and R129’s out there with the M119, which have hundreds of thousands of miles of neglect on them.. but are still running reliably. I have come to realize that the average driver would never be able to take full advantage of the M119 regularly, especially in the US. It obviously really shines higher in the rev range and at very high speeds that would leave an M113 breathless. This is why I still say that the M113 is “good enough,” but not the best, and CERTAINLY not better than the M119.
I’ve seen plenty of stretched chains on the M112 and M113 engines. They almost never completely fail, but it’s very common and noticeable by the distinct chatter they make at idle/low rpm. They also DO commonly have valve guide seal issues at higher mileages... which is unheard of on the beautiful M119. The M119 chains never fail either, but replacing the upper guides is a good preventative measure as they were known to become brittle with age and mileage. The M119 engine never had ANY head gasket, valve guide seal or similar issues as suggested by the description above. It’s obvious that there will be more maintenance involved with an M119 compared to M113 as its a more complex engine, but is well worth it due to its superiority. The M119 is more durable, more refined and makes more power per displacement than the M113. The M113 will be cheaper to own in the long run and is just about as reliable as the M119. Overall the M113 is JUST good enough, but nothing “special” like the M119.
Too bad it’s the M113 and not the exquisite M119. I’d pay more for an earlier one just to have the best V8 that Mercedes ever produced.
Are you seriously keeping a Euro spec W124 wagon in favor of a 400E? Are you crazy? The standard Euro spec cars are dirt cheap and plentiful in Europe and nothing special, while a 400E is fairly rare, highly desirable, sought-after and expensive. Far fewer 400E's were made than any of the lower spec W124's, including the wagons. Most Europeans would consider a 400E a "car for life," because of how special it is and how great of a car it really is. They'd laugh at favoring a lower spec W124 wagon over an incredible 400E. I'm sure most Americans would laugh as well. I suppose people want what they can't have, and a cheaper Euro spec W124 is more "special" to you because they were offered in the US... making them even more rare in the country.
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10k-Mile 1999 Mercedes-Benz SL500
joncf said:
The M113 is a more modern engine??? It is newer, but it lacks variable valve timing, and 4 valve technology that the M119 has.... and which EVERY automaker has since implemented. I would call THAT modern.. not 3 valve, twin spark technology that was invented by Asian automakers in the 80’s. The only benefit would be fewer moving parts and possibly reduced emissions. It certainly didn’t help fuel economy because they are hilariously inefficient.. no better than the M119. Basically every combustion engine being produced today, has 4 valves per cylinder and VVT.. The M113 lacked it.. and they MB never made that mistake again. The twin spark is meaningless in reliability, longevity or performance aspects and was just an attempt to “clean up” emissions. The M119 doesn’t really have any significant known issues if well maintained while the M112 and M113 commonly have oil consumption and valve guide seal issues. I’d say they are equally reliable, but the M119 wins the durability and longevity contest. There are tons of W140’s and R129’s out there with the M119, which have hundreds of thousands of miles of neglect on them.. but are still running reliably. I have come to realize that the average driver would never be able to take full advantage of the M119 regularly, especially in the US. It obviously really shines higher in the rev range and at very high speeds that would leave an M113 breathless. This is why I still say that the M113 is “good enough,” but not the best, and CERTAINLY not better than the M119.10k-Mile 1999 Mercedes-Benz SL500
joncf said:
I’ve seen plenty of stretched chains on the M112 and M113 engines. They almost never completely fail, but it’s very common and noticeable by the distinct chatter they make at idle/low rpm. They also DO commonly have valve guide seal issues at higher mileages... which is unheard of on the beautiful M119. The M119 chains never fail either, but replacing the upper guides is a good preventative measure as they were known to become brittle with age and mileage. The M119 engine never had ANY head gasket, valve guide seal or similar issues as suggested by the description above. It’s obvious that there will be more maintenance involved with an M119 compared to M113 as its a more complex engine, but is well worth it due to its superiority. The M119 is more durable, more refined and makes more power per displacement than the M113. The M113 will be cheaper to own in the long run and is just about as reliable as the M119. Overall the M113 is JUST good enough, but nothing “special” like the M119.10k-Mile 1999 Mercedes-Benz SL500
joncf said:
Too bad it’s the M113 and not the exquisite M119. I’d pay more for an earlier one just to have the best V8 that Mercedes ever produced.1993 Mercedes-Benz 400E
joncf said:
Are you seriously keeping a Euro spec W124 wagon in favor of a 400E? Are you crazy? The standard Euro spec cars are dirt cheap and plentiful in Europe and nothing special, while a 400E is fairly rare, highly desirable, sought-after and expensive. Far fewer 400E's were made than any of the lower spec W124's, including the wagons. Most Europeans would consider a 400E a "car for life," because of how special it is and how great of a car it really is. They'd laugh at favoring a lower spec W124 wagon over an incredible 400E. I'm sure most Americans would laugh as well. I suppose people want what they can't have, and a cheaper Euro spec W124 is more "special" to you because they were offered in the US... making them even more rare in the country.